Twin State Railroad

Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New England

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NHV 669
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Location: In the VT woods, between the Mt. Division and WACR

Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by NHV 669 » Sun Sep 01, 2019 11:34 pm

gokeefe wrote:
Sun Sep 01, 2019 7:48 am
How much traffic is NHCR generating right now?
Business with Rymes is good on the Stratford end, don't have specific numbers. Noted that they're recieving some storage cars again as well.

Whitefield end is just the hopper(s) of plastic pellets at this point, roughly a single car a month, give or take a week. Routing is CSX/PAS/PAR/SLR just to get the car to Groveton.
Casey

NHVT 669 sits at the south end of the "Pompy" line in White River Jct., VT on 4/29/1993. Photo by Richard Roberg.

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BandA
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by BandA » Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:15 am

Good time for the state to buy the ROW since it is "worthless" the price will never be lower.

gokeefe
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by gokeefe » Tue Sep 03, 2019 9:52 am

The information available seems to hint (just barely) that there may be some kind of railroad use under consideration.
gokeefe

b&m 1566
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by b&m 1566 » Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:05 am

BandA wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:15 am
Good time for the state to buy the ROW since it is "worthless" the price will never be lower.
Pan Am might not be in a rush to sell it if the price is too low. Is the line from St. Johnsbury, VT to Whitefield, NH abandoned or is it still under common carrier? I'm not a wiz when it comes real-estate property but I would have to imagine the value might be higher if not abandoned vs abandoned.

gokeefe
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by gokeefe » Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:24 am

It has never been abandoned. At this point if Twin State's rights have lapsed then (I believe) the rights revert to Maine Central d/b/a Pan Am Railways.
gokeefe

newpylong
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by newpylong » Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:56 am

gokeefe wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 9:52 am
The information available seems to hint (just barely) that there may be some kind of railroad use under consideration.
To do what? There is nothing online and there are no bridge route considerations.

gokeefe
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by gokeefe » Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:02 pm

At the moment NHCR is dependent on a single carrier. That would be one possible consideration.

Much further up thread VRS supposedly indicated interest in a more direct route to Portland, Maine in 2014. My assumption is Pan Am would of course be the carrier. This concept seems unlikely to materialize but it was nonetheless surprising to read about.

Speaking broadly I have been surprised at times by the occurrence of serious conversations about the (former) Mountain Division. It has come up more than I would have ever expected. The one particular example I'm thinking of was focused only opportunities in Maine.
gokeefe

Cowford
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by Cowford » Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:18 pm

"Serious" conversation regarding reactivation of the Mountain sub would imply that a railroad (and the Golden Eagle Railway doesn't count) was at least one of the parties involved in the conversation. I know of no such confirmed dialogues.

gokeefe
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by gokeefe » Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:19 pm

Definitely not Golden Eagle and I will leave it at that ...
gokeefe

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NHV 669
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by NHV 669 » Tue Sep 03, 2019 1:15 pm

VRS already has a direct route to Portland via PAR. Why would they want a duplicate route that adds an extra carrier, on track that has been OOS for twenty years?

The trees in Concord village as of Sunday are thick enough to completely obscure the RoW west of the station.
Casey

NHVT 669 sits at the south end of the "Pompy" line in White River Jct., VT on 4/29/1993. Photo by Richard Roberg.

newpylong
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by newpylong » Tue Sep 03, 2019 2:50 pm

gokeefe wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 12:02 pm
At the moment NHCR is dependent on a single carrier. That would be one possible consideration.

Much further up thread VRS supposedly indicated interest in a more direct route to Portland, Maine in 2014. My assumption is Pan Am would of course be the carrier. This concept seems unlikely to materialize but it was nonetheless surprising to read about.

Speaking broadly I have been surprised at times by the occurrence of serious conversations about the (former) Mountain Division. It has come up more than I would have ever expected. The one particular example I'm thinking of was focused only opportunities in Maine.
I don't believe any of these would warrant even a passing thought of reactivation.

b&m 1566
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by b&m 1566 » Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:34 pm

Would if be worth it to NHCR to explore at least having trackage rights to St. Johnsbury? Would having a 2nd railroad to interchange with, give them a competitive market with the rates to try and grow some more business? Would it be worth it to have VRS meet them halfway in Gilman or something? I know there's next to nothing up there for business but would it be worth trying to attract business?

gokeefe
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by gokeefe » Tue Sep 03, 2019 7:05 pm

NHV 669 wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 1:15 pm
VRS already has a direct route to Portland via PAR.
I believe it's via PAS. If true that could be the answer. Pan Am could a higher division of the rate by (in some senses) stealing their own traffic.
gokeefe

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NHV 669
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by NHV 669 » Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:15 am

Why would they be worried about competitive rates on traffic that amounts to a single car a month that would require at least three other carriers no matter which way it arrives? All of this sounds quite silly, to be honest.

Business hasn't grown, because there is none.
Casey

NHVT 669 sits at the south end of the "Pompy" line in White River Jct., VT on 4/29/1993. Photo by Richard Roberg.

newpylong
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Re: Twin State Railroad

Post by newpylong » Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:28 am

b&m 1566 wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:34 pm
Would if be worth it to NHCR to explore at least having trackage rights to St. Johnsbury? Would having a 2nd railroad to interchange with, give them a competitive market with the rates to try and grow some more business? Would it be worth it to have VRS meet them halfway in Gilman or something? I know there's next to nothing up there for business but would it be worth trying to attract business?
No because no one is going to pay to rebuild 20 something miles for them just to market that 1 car a month to a VRS gateway.

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