Toledo Jct. and Mansfield

[Beech Cricker]

In the coming days a friend and I intend to conclude our exploration of the ex-PRR Toledo Branch, specifically Tiro-Toledo Jct. A few questions:

(1) Can one even find the location of Toledo Jct. today? Is it accessible?

(2) Is there anything to see in nearby Mansfield, railroad-wise?

Jeff

[shlustig]

BC,

IIRC, you can drive close to the old Toledo Jct. site, but cannot directly access it. You can get a distant view off the highway bridge.

At Mansfield, there is (was) local power assigned to the Oak St. Yard, and good access on the SW corner across from the yard office. Also, a public highway crossing at the East End with a parking area. Biggest drawback is the reduction of traffic under NS. Something like only 2 roundtrips daily instead of 20 or so.

Ashland Rwy. operates the old B&O main north to Willard and the old Erie mainline east to Ashland and W. Salem. The B&O south of Mansfield has become an all-purpose trail. The Erie west of town still serves the plants out at Ontario.

The diamonds are still in where the old B&O crossed the Ft. Wayne Line.

If you look for Vernon Jct. where the PRR crossed the Big Four (now CSX), you may still find the tower site.

Hope this helps.

[MR77100]

Where did the EL cross the PRR? If you want to access Toledo Jct. you can also use the grade crossing west of the curve where the PRR ducks under that overpass. The old ROW is still visible. I think the PRR was torn up from Toledo Jct. to Tiro in 1959. Can someone clarify this? Also, was there a tower at Toledo Jct?

[Beech Cricker]

SHL,

Is the highway bridge you mentioned Route 39?

Is the Oak Street Yard on the east side of town along the Rocky Fork?

Who operates the ex-Erie main to Ontario?

Vernon Jct. is definitely on my list of sites to see.

Jeff

[Beech Cricker]

MR,

Is the grade crossing you mention SR 314? Is the Toledo Branch grade itself driveable from 314 to Toledo Jct.?

Yes, there was a tower at Toledo Jct., according to some old PRR signal diagrams.

Jeff

[MR77100]

I believe the road was State Route 314. The crossing had gates. My father and I walked down the tracks to where Toledo Jct. once was. The Toledo main was drivable when I was there. I was surprised that the ROW was still in good condition.

[MR77100]

I want to know more operation of the PRR Toledo Line. I know Conrail took the through service off of it in 1984. When did the last train run, when were the block signals removed, when were the tracks pulled up? I know Conrail used trackage rights over N&W from Bucyrus to Carrothers.

[shlustig]

BC,

The Bridge is SR-39.
Oak St. Yard is on the East Side of Mansfield.

The Erie and the PRR crossed just East of SR-13 on the North Side of Downtown. The B&O and PRR crossed at SR-13. The Erie and the B&O
crossed a couple blocks West of SR-13 closer to Downtown.

Conrail got off the old PRR after a rear-end collision between
Carruthers and Colsan (Bucyrus). Our crew maintained that they
had a false "Clear" signal, and subsequent investigation showed
problems from voltage leaks from the hi-tension lines along the
N&W (ex-PRR). N&W refused to admit that any problem existed,
and Mr. Crane ordered the route discontinued. We had 2 through-
freight roundtrips (PITO/TOPI A&B) plus extras, IIRC.

If you use a DeLorme Atlas, the routes show clearly.

Hope this helps.

[Beech Cricker]

SHL and MR,

Good info, I appreciate it. I'll let you know how we make out with our exploration of the southernmost end of the PRR branch as well as nearby Mansfield.

Jeff

[nycstlrr]

Vernon Jct is very visable, I live a few miles from there. The ROW is visible for almost the whole way. If you get on Stein Road, you will have a great view of the tree lined ROW. Hummel road still has a bridge standing it is now a driveway. ROW grade crossing is very visable at ST Rt 61 (this is almost right at Vernon Jct.) There is also a bridge still standing at 314 crossing. ROW is still very visable through Tiro. I could go on and on. You will be able to see a ton. I know of at least 2 other bridges that are standing as well.

Let me know when you hit the area, I may be able to show you some things.

Tiro would be a place to visit. There is a PRR boxcar on the ground there and a lot of other things around.

I cross the ROW 4 times a day myself. I always look both ways when I cross. A lot of history there.

If anyone wants more information on this or railfanning in Mansfield or Shelby let me know. Mansfield is about dead anymore. I lived there for 15 years and the traffic now really stinks!!!! You can count on a 12v and 13V everyday along with 68J and 69J. C27 and C37 are locals along with a few coal trains that run through every once in a while. Far cry from the Conrail days. Shelby has 20 or more trains a day going through, plus there are 2 Ashland Railway trains during the week. They do switching at the industrial park so they are easy to catch.

nycstlrr

[Beech Cricker]

[quote="nycstlrr"]Vernon Jct is very visable, I live a few miles from there.

We found the Vernon Jct. tower foundation, just after a very long CSX train (with three UP units + CSX unit) passed. But what are the concrete foundations on the other side of the ex-NYC line?



The ROW is visible for almost the whole way.

Actually we lost the r-o-w in several spots between just south of Tiro and Vernon Jct. It appears to have been plowed under by local farmers.



If you get on Stein Road, you will have a great view of the tree lined ROW.

We were there--checked out the neat concrete bridge just NE of the Stein Road/SR 314 intersection. What is that sign all about at the south end of this bridge?



Hummel road still has a bridge standing it is now a driveway.

I don't see Hummel Road on the DeLorme.




Let me know when you hit the area, I may be able to show you some things.

Dang, seems you wrote your note at about the time we were heading back to my friend's place in Bowling Green.




Tiro would be a place to visit. There is a PRR boxcar on the ground there and a lot of other things around.

Saw the PRR boxcar. What else is at Tiro?



I cross the ROW 4 times a day myself. I always look both ways when I cross. A lot of history there.

: )



If anyone wants more information on this or railfanning in Mansfield or Shelby let me know. Mansfield is about dead anymore. I lived there for 15 years and the traffic now really stinks!!!! You can count on a 12v and 13V everyday along with 68J and 69J. C27 and C37 are locals along with a few coal trains that run through every once in a while. Far cry from the Conrail days.

We caught a solid e/b gon train behind two NS units and a BNSF pumpkin on the Fort Wayne Line at the SR 314 xing. Any idea as to this train's symbol?

From here we parked at the SR 39 bridge and walked the service road west to the signals. Where was Toledo Jct. in relation to these signals? All we could see up ahead (west) was trees, no grade (Toledo Branch) cutting off northward. Maybe we didn't go far enough west.



Shelby has 20 or more trains a day going through, plus there are 2 Ashland Railway trains during the week. They do switching at the industrial park so they are easy to catch.

We spotted an orange and white switcher, #66--whose is this?

We found the Oak Street Yard, now apparently called "Mansfield Yard" by NS, based on a sign. Neat little yard. Power tied up at its west end, along with a CR bay window caboose.

Also at Mansfield, we found the B&O station, B&O/Erie xing and B&O/PRR xing. Not sure about the Erie/PRR xing. Was this just east of what is now NS' Diamond Street MofW bldg (is this an ex Erie structure?)? Is the diamond gone? If so, how does the Ashland go from the B&O station area, cross the PRR, then access its line heading northward (by compass) to reach its namesake town?

Other odds and ends...

Found the tower foundation at New Washington (STACK). This must have been a small tower, perhaps a one-story affair?

On the way down caught W&LE action at Carey, as well as a CSX train bringing in empty stone cars. On the return caught a s/b CSX train on the Toledo Branch with three UP units plus one CSX at Galatea. We thought he was waiting for an e/b CSX piggyback train to cross but after it did, he still did not move. I wonder if he was holding to wait for President Bush's motorcade to pass by?

Jeff

[emtboo]

You asked about the EL west of Mansfield, I didn't see a reply for that one. The NS runs out to GM yard in Ontario which is the old EL right of way. They of course serve the GM plant there. Usually the power is parked at the west end of the yard by the Ohio 430 underpass and the track ends maybe a quarter mile or less west of that underpass. I was surprised no one mentioned the B&O passenger station/office? that still stands just west of where the Ashland (B&O) combines with the NS (EL). I don't know the name of the street on which it is located but it was still there last month. Also if you are looking closely you can trace where the Erie (I don't think this track survived up to EL days) had trackage along East 6th street (not sure) and the foundation for the old freight house still is in place on Walnut St. Where 6th and Walnut cross there is an interesting building there that was built adjacent to the tracks and is built on the curve where the tracks come from the north and curve east down 6th street to serve some warehouses on that street.

[MR77100]

Several years ago, my father and I walked the EL ROW from a point west of Ontario to the end of track. The end of track is in the woods and runs into a pile of ballest. Where did the EL cross the PRR in Mansfield and when was the diamond removed?

[Beech Cricker]

emtboo,

Thanks for the info on Ontario, OH. I guess we may have missed something by not going there. I didn't realize NS operated this line--would have thought it was the Ashland Rwy. But being that this branch serves a GM plant I guess I'm not surprised that it is NS (likely a good traffic source, one a Class 1 would like to keep).

I did mention the ex-B&O station in Mansfield, though in passing, in my long note above.

So the Ashland operates the former EL main from Mansfield east and the NS from Mansfield west. Where is the split?


All, someone needs to put together a map of Mansfield in terms of what is and what was. Hint, hint!

Jeff

[emtboo]

Hey Jeff,

I guess I should have taken the time to read your posting more thouroughly. I see your reference to the B&O station. The EL tracks ran on the north side of that building you referenced that is now a NS MOW office. It is an old EL building, the double track curved north and crossed the PRR on a curve as well, the station was served by both the Erie and PRR, unfortunately it didn't survive Conrail. Currently the Ashland only uses the B&O yard along St Rt 13 to access the steel mill for coil steel loading. They use the old, rather poorly maintained B&O/EL interchange track to access the EL eastward. If you get back to Mansfield some day, the Ashland uses the old EL main almost up to the where they crossed the PRR for loading or unloading (not sure) trash gons. Usually you can see them across the NS tracks when traveling on St Rt 13. If you did see them, that is the old main line. I tried to look up some old maps on line to see if they showed all this great RR interchanging and the only I found that did had such bad resolution it isn't worth sending out. If I find anything worth sending to you I will. Talk to you later.

JOHN