Toledo, OH

[WNYRailfan]

I have a bunch of questions about Toledo and the surrounding area.

1. What rail line used to run just south of where I-75 and OH-25 intersect (north of city park ave)?
The bridges are still in place, but the rail is gone.

2. On US-24 (Detroit Ave.) heading north of Phillips Ave. you cross a set of tracks at grade. Then about 0.5 mile north of Phillips Ave. there looks to be an old railroad bridge abutment covered by trees and plants. What line was this and where is the other abutment?

3. The Toledo Terminal Railway is severed at Jackman Rd. Does this mean that the Smuckers plan is only served from the East?
Also, does that mean that there are never trains West of Jackman road (e.g. by UT Campus)?

4. How busy is the rail junction that is practically underneath the Alexis Rd. (OH-184) overpass? Which railroads cross there and which one has the right of way?

5. Where are the yards in Toledo and the surrounding area? What are they named?

6. Did the TT ever have any stations in and around Toledo besides the Union Station?

[nycrick]

Here are some answers:

1) From your description I think what you saw is the old NKP (ex-Cloverleaf). They were one of the RRs here that didn't use Union Station & these tracks lead to their station at Erie & LaFayette in downtown. Some of the tracks are still in place, I'm not sure that N&W "officially" file for abandoment of these tracks when they discontinued use.

2) The oldbridge abutment came off of the MC & Canada Southern. I believe it was the PRR interchange. The other abutment was torn down.

3) There hasn't been any rail service on this part of the TTRR since the end of CR. The only parts of the TT still in use are in East Toledo & a short section east of Jackman to gain access to the ex-DT&I yard and a GM plant.

4) Alexis Jct. is quite busy although I don't know the train count. The RRs crossing there are the NS to Detroit, CSX to Detroit and the AA to Ann Arbor.

5) Toledo use to be the third largest rail center in the U.S. so there's quite a few yards here. Going clock-wise around a map of town there's NS's Homestead (ex-W&LE) at about 4 o'clock, thenCSX's Walbridge (ex-HV) & Stanley (exT&OC) at 7, just south of Union Station is NS's Sumner St. (ex-WAB) along the river, next is the ex-DT&I Temperance Yard at 12. In N. Toledo at about 2 o'clock is a cluster of yards: GT's Lang (exD&TSL), AA's Ottawa & CSX's Boulevard or Plymouth (ex-TTRR).
At 3 is CSX Presque Isle coal docks & NS's Front St. Yard. Then right in the middle is NS's Airline Jct. (ex-LS&MS) this is where the north-south and east-west lines join. There are a lot more smaller yards around but I don't know their names, most are unused now.

6) The TTRR never used Union Station. They had their own station on Cherry St. on the same block were the stations of the AA and the W&LE.
In fact the TTRR never ran passenger trains. The only passenger use of their station was the Pere Marquette for 2 years in 1907-09.

Hope this helps. On page 48 of the Great Lakes East edition of SPV's RR Atlasd is a map of Toledo, it'll probably give you better info than I did.

[MR77100]

Where are the best hot spots in Toledo?

[walt]

I don't know muich about Toledo, however, in addition to the railroads mentioned here, Toledo was once served by a number of electric interurban railways, among them the Cincinnati & Lake Erie RR,( from the south), The Lake Shore Electric ( from Cleveland) and the Eastern Michigan -Toledo RR (from the North) since these three interurbans were gone before 1940, I don't know how much, if any, of their old infrastructure is left.

[MP297W]

Where are the best hot spots in Toledo?

Vickers is good, it's the CSX/NS crossing. Walbridge itself is a good place to watch, but be very careful not to park on railroad property. I saw the first C60 I had ever seen close up getting ready to leave, and I stopped in the parking lot to watch/hear it pull out. I never got out of my car, but within a minute of my parking, I hear on the scanner "silver Jeep". Well, I start to pull out, knowing it's me they are talking about, and I don't even get the car started and there's the CSX PD. I was all the way out by the curb, almost in the street, and he tresspasses me!

This is pre 911 by a couple of years, BTW. I ask him why. He says, and I can't believe this "logic", "Well, they don't know what you are going to do, you might have a rifle or something, and shoot someone". When was the last time you heard anyone go to company property and shoot somebody, or do anything else newsworthy. If I was going to shoot, there were much better places to shoot from than next to a public street in town less than an 1/8th mile from the Police Station!

My name on this board MP297W is at the NS tracks and Holloway Road in Holland, OH. Right now, the normal parking lot is full of sewer pipe and heavy construction equipment, but you can park on the grass. A new fence is an annoying recent addition..

[matt]

Is this where the park with the caboose is located? Is that strip of grass along the north side of the tracks public property?

Thanks.

[WNYRailfan]

Who owns the Caboose?

Oh so the fence is new?
I only have been here in Toledo for 1 month, so...I don't know much history.

There seems to be a lot of action on the NS. I was in SAMS on Friday and heard 4 trains less than 1 hours time.

The only thing NS is good for is running the railroad and the decent power. They are not railfan friendly!!! And according to many people in Buffalo, when they were N&W they were even less railfan friendly.

[nycrick]

The caboose was given to the Springfield Township Trustees by N&W about 4-5 years ago. The plan is to build a trainwatchers park around it with a photographers platform, etc... It'll be connected via a bike path to a park (Homecoming?) about 1/2 mile west. The problem right now is that in 2003 their application for a state grant to build the park was turned down. So the money isn't there now & all work on the park is voluntary which is why its slow in getting done.
The fence went up in February '04, NS probably wouldn't let them build a bike path along the ROW without it.

[WNYRailfan]

The caboose was given to the Springfield Township Trustees by N&W about 4-5 years ago.

I think you mean NS...NS was formed in 1989 when the Southern RR purchased the N&W.

Was it an original Wabash or NKP? Or was it always N&W?

The plan is to build a trainwatchers park around it with a photographers platform, etc... It'll be connected via a bike path to a park (Homecoming?) about 1/2 mile west.

Platform??? What do you mean by that?

The problem right now is that in 2003 their application for a state grant to build the park was turned down. So the money isn't there now & all work on the park is voluntary which is why its slow in getting done.
The fence went up in February '04, NS probably wouldn't let them build a bike path along the ROW without it.

How long do you think it will be until there is a hole in the fence big enough for a camera lens?

Click the link below to see a fence discussion:
[url=http://]http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=475[/url]

[nycrick]

1) The news release said N&W. Maybe they meant NS or had the years wrong; the Blade isn't the best paper around.

2) You'll have to ask the Township what platform means.

3) Whenever someone takes a wire cutter to it, I just hope it's not a railfan.

[nycrick]

To clarify the previous post:

I believe they were talking about a platform like the one in Rochelle, IL.

If a reader here lives in Springfield Township maybe they could suggest to the board that camera portals be put in the fence. I don't live there and this kind of suggestion might carry more weight if it were made by a resident.