Metrolink Crash in Chatsworth, CA - 9/12/08

snakebite wrote:

concordgirl wrote:If the engineer had survived it'd be his livelihood people are talking about. I know what Metrolink is saying, I just think when you're talking abt someone's career you owe it to them to come to a thoughtful, rather than hasty, decision. If the ntsb confirms it was all his fault, fine, then we know 100% that he screwed up.

Yes! You are correct, c-girl. Thank you for saying that. Finally, a little empathy around here!

Not only that... the reason to find fault is not just to lay blame and determine legal responsibility, but also to find out how to keep it from happening again. If somehow it was NOT the engineer's fault, there's something else going on here. We don't need more people getting killed because of a problem that is there and goes undiscovered because of quick fingerpointing.

icgsteve wrote:

On Sept. 2, Sanchez also was reportedly involved in a fatal train crash with a pedestrian. Higgins said the NTSB was looking into the incident.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... eheadlines

Unfortunate part of this is that most folks reading the paper are likely to think "see, he killed another person just days before -- a history of unsafe driving" not "that must have really affected him."

Seatbelts on a train really might not be such a terrible idea. Aren't plenty of people injured slamming into other junk on board? Though I guess trains don't come to an absolute stop as fast as a car generally does.

concordgirl wrote:And to the person who commented that many engineers prolly go their whole career without a fatality, I doubt that. I've been a buff for only one year and I know maybe 3 or 4 engineers to talk to. Of those 3 or 4, 2 were involved in fatalities during the past year. And that's just the ones I know. It's a fact of life in that industry.

On September 11th, I started my 13th year as a railroader. It is my 10th year as an engineer. I've been involved in 2 fatalities already. Out of everybody in my terminal, from the guys with less than 2 years to the old heads, I can only count about 8 people who have gone their entire careers without a fatality. And all 8 of them have less than 15 years of service.

Yep, a sad fact of life it is.

snakebite wrote:

Mitch wrote:Running a train is stressful no matter what.

No offense, but in my experience, running a passenger train is like a walk in park compared to a 19,000 ton DP coal train on mountain grade. Stressful? Gee, sorry, but I don't see that. Passenger runs were more like taking a day off, in terms of stress for me anyway. You pull the throttle and you go, put on the brakes and you stop. This guy probably had more stress driving on the freeway to/from work in LA.

Did you use motive power or were you pulling those cars yourself?

Are you under the impression I never ran a freight train, or worked in mainline freight?

The operation of a train that has to meet a schedule, run on single track, requires the engineman to take train orders while operating the train, calling employees in charge for permission to go through work territory, having the dispatcher call you concernng a missing parcel a passenger left in the 3rd car, in the span of 3 minutes while going over highway crossings with baloney heads going around the gates, a railfan sliding the cab door open to ask, "Were these cars built by Budd?" while you bang along at 85 (oops I mean 79 mph) with only a piece of glass for protection gave me the impression that I was under stress. More stress than I feel now meeting deadlines and meeting with clients. As for freight at 3am with a lashup of SDs going up the mainline in the 8th peg seemed to me to be a walk in the park.

We can sit here all day comparing our apples to oranges, and potatoes and the whole produce department, trying to polish our railroading merit badges but running a train, even a work train, is stressful.

Was that a red fusee I just saw? Were those torpedoes, or did you have chili for lunch?

Spokker wrote:

Mitch wrote:

Spokker wrote: You don't think some yosh will enact this on the strength of my post now do you? Or do you?

I wasn't serious about the "No speculation" line. It was to make fun of those who refuse to speculate on anything and therefore feel superior to the rest of us who use a discussion forum for what it's for - discussion.

I know you were just kidding. But I'm an old ex-rail and have the propensity for making wise-cracks. It's kinda like being in the locker room between runs.

By the way, in addition, being a conductor or trainman in passenger service, especially commuter service is stressful. I had a drunk guy once making a huge problem on board. I told him to knock it off or I'd invite him to leave the train at the next stop. He blurpped,"I want your badge number." I slipped the embroidered band, that said "collector" off my cap, I looked at it inside and out and said,"I don't think there's any number on here." I stopped running when I got about 3 cars back.

maybe its time to close this tread as its no longer anywhere's near discussing the Metrolink crash.
were now down to railing and exchanging old war stories.

Sorry for asking this question but I am a transit man and am not familuar with CR ops too well. That said my question is the NTSB is doing the investigation is the FRA involved and what rold do they play if any?

StevieC48 wrote:Sorry for asking this question but I am a transit man and am not familuar with CR ops too well. That said my question is the NTSB is doing the investigation is the FRA involved and what rold do they play if any?

FRA may perform its own investigation, separate from that of the NTSB, but generally they will provide a supporting role for the NTSB investigation. See their site:

http://www.fra.dot.gov/us/content/1696

Jim

There's a preliminary FRA report making the rounds on line. No answers of major consequence but a couple details -

Point of collision was MP 444.14

Commuter train was supposed to wait at Control Point Topanga

UP freight had strawberries, plastics, and miscellaneous other goods

UP lead loco was 8485

Metrolink loco was 855

Well, so.... not much mystery left, only one question really: Why did the commuter train not wait at Topanga like it was supposed to? It's like Rosebud in Citizen Kane....

They have postd the 911 calls it is verry disturbing::

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,424664,00.html

I dont know if this was asked but, what was the fate of the UP crew?

They survived but injured.

Yes, please, let's make sure we are on the subject of Metrolink. Thank you.

-otto-

We'll the ME should definately be able to determine if this guy had a medical problem from him being diabetic or not, diabetics don't just have problems unless there sugar level drops to low or goes to high. I'm sure once the ME report is released that will shine some light on the situation but I'm still thinking the guy had to be awake if he just made a station stop prior and was notching back on the throttle.