CNJ Southern Secondary Woodmansie - Winslow

I’m not sure. The only reason to go to Bridgeton/Millville from Oak Island directly via the Southern would be if the majority of the traffic is coming from the CSX River Sub. It’s 27 miles shorter than going through Philly and Camden via the Trenton Sub.

I need to look into this further to see where the traffic comes from.

When the refinery business was much larger in NJ, Conrail ran an all-day switcher moving between North Jersey and South Jersey, switching all the refineries along the way. They ran down the Trenton Sub, not using the old CNJ route. Many of those chemical industries in north NJ are gone.
The rail industry has large economies of scale, but those large economies of scale also mean that a daily short train between north and south jersey would likely never justify the cost of upgrading the NJ Coast Line.

Not quite. A train coming up from Winslow could take the switch at Farmingdale onto the FIT, which would then take them onto the Amboy Secondary, which already dumps out onto the Coastline just before the Raritan River bridge. That bridge is being replaced and (I believe) will be able to handle Plate F/286K cars after it is replaced by a new one. North of that bridge the Coastline can handle 286K cars (per this slide from the NJTPA PowerPoint, https://imgur.com/a/zHcoCVh), and there's plenty of freight there.

I do think that the Raritan River Bridge replacement + the project to reconnect Freehold and Farmingdale could suggest there's a Winslow-Woodmansie reconnection potential in the near future. Especially after they upgraded all that rail between Woodmansie and Lakehurst for the mythical sand trains...

Bracdude181 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 10, 2022 7:57 pm I’m not sure. The only reason to go to Bridgeton/Millville from Oak Island directly via the Southern would be if the majority of the traffic is coming from the CSX River Sub. It’s 27 miles shorter than going through Philly and Camden via the Trenton Sub.

I need to look into this further to see where the traffic comes from.

Also, the Trenton Subdivision has SEPTA on it. The Southern, FIT, and Amboy Secondary all (currently) have no passenger rail on them.

I think it's a little of the chicken or the egg thing. There's not enough traffic to justify redoing it, but if it were still operational, there probably would be. Maybe "if you build it, they will come".

@JohnFromJersey The Trenton Sub and Septa use separate tracks that run parallel at certain points. The Trenton Sub is single tracked with sidings all the way down.

CharlieL wrote: ↑Fri Feb 11, 2022 8:51 pm I think it's a little of the chicken or the egg thing. There's not enough traffic to justify redoing it, but if it were still operational, there probably would be. Maybe "if you build it, they will come".

Yeah, current traffic currently uses other routes, but as Bracdude said, Woodmansie-Winslow would reduce the travel distance by about 27-30 miles, which could easily be a couple of hours knocked off travel time. If you also reconnected the rails south of Winslow that go to Vineland, you could reduce that even further.

I'd imagine whenever the Glassboro-Camden line comes around, you could reduce the number of freight trains they interact with by rerouting them over a revival of the original Southern Division.

Rebuilding the line north of Winslow at the very least would be a long-term investment. It would also help with other projects, think of more options for transloading/intermodal facilities and NJT. Think MOM + proper North Jersey-South Jersey commuter rail connections.

I think we could expect to see the line reactivated, just not anytime soon. There's really no other reason why I can see some of the upgrades being done to the Amboy Secondary + FIT/SOUS unless they were thinking far far into the future, which would be a first

@JohnFromJersey The Amboy Secondary between South Amboy and Jamesburg consists of welded rail and has a speed limit of 25 MPH. Very little of this section needs upgrading. Some crossings need work and some spots need tamping, both are easy fixes.

The Freehold Industrial is okay but some spots need immediate repairs. Especially between Freehold and Englishtown. At Mt Vernon road the track is bent and out of gauge, and near Reed & Pereane the ballast is leftover coal dust from the days of PRR steam on the line. The bridge near Monmouth Battlefield needs replacement, and crossings need electric protection along the whole line.

Just on Winslow to Vineland I’m still thinking about how that would play out. SRNJ has the rights to operate that section at the moment.

Ive had the idea of having Winchester and Western going to Winslow to exchange cars with whoever would bring them down from North Jersey, but then what does that mean for SRNJ if they do it this way? Do they lose that section of track and only go to Pleasantville? Or do they get overhead trackage rights to serve current and future customers who may pop up on that section?

Winslow-Vineland is still part of the original Southern Division, which NJDOT owns, which means CR would probably be predominately operating on that line. No need to do a transfer at Winslow.