All things Pennsylvanian AND Keystone West

Superliners can NEVER go to New York' s Penn Station due to clearences. During the Papal visit
To Philadelphia the Superliners staid in nearby Penn coach yard. A number of year's ago Amtrak
Had an equipment exibition at 30th st. Superliners were included, but single level cars were
used as a "bridge" to reach them since only the single level cars could properly platform at
tracks with escalators.

SRich wrote:so what your saying is that every dead engine (diesel or electric) that it is dead in tow needs an driver onboard ?

Umm....where did you see me say that?



I said nothing of the sort. Certain engines of certain classes need to be live in tow so the can communicate certain pieces of information to other units. Other units in certain classes must be dead in tow if they have defects and are connected to certain classes of engines since it is possible for the fault to actually travel to another unit and shut it down (for lack of a better term, the fault spreads like a virus.)

Even better are the classes of units that work together or work together in pull/pull service...but will not work with other classes on the opposite end. The best were the AEM-7s, which wouldn't work together in pull-pull service (engines on the opposing ends) but you could obviously double them up.

The bottom line is, if the units can not relay certain pieces of information to each other, a rider is necessary regardless of position in the consist or class and these two classes of engines don't play so nice with each other, particularly with one unit dead in tow. Then again, what does an ACS play nice with? they don't even really play nice with each other!

bill613A wrote:During the recent Papal visit to Philadelphia Amtrak ran a superliner special to Penn Station so it can be done. As far as equipment goes a sleeper and coach from the current CAPITOL pool could be used. Two cross country lounge cars would be needed running from Pittsburgh to Philadelphia which would need to be modified to mu with the single level equipment which would run NY-PITT to maintain the current ridership. As mentioned modifying the current PENNSYLVANIAN schedule would really bolster the service on this route.

As ExNYC63 stated, the Superliner consist never made it past Penn Coach Yard. Superliners are prohibited in 30th station except when authorized by the Superintendent. Before that occurs, the catenary must be de-energized. That is hardly optimal conditions for scheduled revenue service.

ThirdRail7 wrote:
Umm....where did you see me say that?

I said nothing of the sort. Certain engines of certain classes need to be live in tow so the can communicate certain pieces of information to other units. Other units in certain classes must be dead in tow if they have defects and are connected to certain classes of engines since it is possible for the fault to actually travel to another unit and shut it down (for lack of a better term, the fault spreads like a virus.)

Even better are the classes of units that work together or work together in pull/pull service...but will not work with other classes on the opposite end. The best were the AEM-7s, which wouldn't work together in pull-pull service (engines on the opposing ends) but you could obviously double them up.

The bottom line is, if the units can not relay certain pieces of information to each other, a rider is necessary regardless of position in the consist or class and these two classes of engines don't play so nice with each other, particularly with one unit dead in tow. Then again, what does an ACS play nice with? they don't even really play nice with each other!

Strange
Here in Europe and The Netherlands, locos(death in tow) can be put in a consist and everything is stil working. Also the death loc can be started and run with out problems.

a small question: Does the ACS-64 works with an GE P42/32 DM, in dual power mode, so when the first loc ask for power both machines go and deliver traction power?

When a train is "rescued" with a protect engine, the dead engine is bypassed electrically.

An odd thought here: Are the Siemens Chargers that MTA Maryland is getting for MARC also rated for the long-haul that is PGH-PHL? I would have to guess that they're half-way there if they can do Martinsburg (MRB) to DC (WAS). That would solve half the problem of power if the Chargers can make the route (the other half being the coach cars).

I'm not sure every Siemens Charger being assembled has the same size fuel tank, but other States are buying them for Amtrak trains with routes longer than Philadelphia to Pittsburgh.
Relative distances in track miles:

Chicago to Port Huron 319
New York City to Pittsburgh 444
Vancouver to Eugene 467
Chicago to Kansas City via St. Louis 567

So I'm sure a Siemens Charger can have a large enough fuel tank to run Philadelphia to Pittsburgh without running out of fuel.

92 of those miles are electric at the very least

Just to note, there are Vancouver-Portland trains (344 miles) and Seattle-Eugene trains (310 miles) but no Vancouver-Eugene trains.

With respect to the rest, are there plans to run Chicago-KC through trains?

There are through trains between Chicago and Kansas City, with approximately an hour stop in St. Louis. I'll admit I don't know if those trains refuel in St. Louis or not?

Is a diesel locomotive used on the Pennsylvanian the entire way from New York City to Pittsburgh?
Relative track miles:
New York City to Pittsburgh 444
Philadelphia to Pittsburgh 353
Harrisburg to Pittsburgh 249

Assuming they swap locomotives in Philadelphia, 353 miles isn't that much further than 344 or 310 miles.

An electric takes the train from NY to Philly and gets removed there. The diesel is added to the other end for the trip to Pittsburgh. Currently, an electric is temporarily placed in front of the diesel from Philly to Harrisburg because of the new PTC installation between PHL and HAR.

Hmmm... I wonder if the PTC between HAR and PGH is in the works, and if the two installs will be compatible.

STrRedWolf wrote:When a train is "rescued" with a protect engine, the dead engine is bypassed electrically.

I mean the two engines (Diesel and Electric) can they work together? So by example an P42,ACS-64 and a consist. Can you run the ACS from the P42?

chuchubob wrote:An electric takes the train from NY to Philly and gets removed there. The diesel is added to the other end for the trip to Pittsburgh. Currently, an electric is temporarily placed in front of the diesel from Philly to Harrisburg because of the new PTC installation between PHL and HAR.

So when is this arrangement supposed to end? Otherwise, why not just add a cab car and do the whole diesel/electric switch at Harrisburg..........

The P40's and P42's will need to be rigged with ACSES equipment and whatever PTC setup that NS will install.
H-burg is still being rebuilt at track level,so powerswaps are not easy for now,the ACS-64 has to lead due to ACSES
is now online to H-burg.


Believe the ACS-64 and P-40/42's can MU to each other thru the 27 point MU line,they have in the past
when the 25kv wire or MN's 12,5 kv wire is shutdown for repairs east of NY Penn.