Northeast Regional 188 - Accident In Philadelphia

Congressional hearing just ended.

I only caught last 10 or 15 minutes, but I heard some discussion of the following:
- seat belts on trains
- why no one can determine if engineer was using cell phone at time of crash
- rocks thrown at trains in same time period as crash
- unknown whether windshield fracture occurred before or after crash
- frustration that we still don't know the cause of the crash after 3 weeks

If I recall rightly, chairman of the committee expressed disappointment that
we still don't know if any defects in equipment contributed to the crash.

NSTB chairman then said that, so far, no "anomalies" have been found in
the tracks, signals or the train.

I assume that a transcript of the hearing will be available, though I don't
know when.

Gary

I am betting the engineer was NOT using his cell phone and had it properly stowed away. That is why we have not heard anything about that aspect. In past, if a cell phone was a catalyst in a wreck, the media usually would have their hands on that within a week or sooner, as was done with Chatsworth, and at least one or two MBTA light rail collisions.

As for the overall cause of the crash, it has only been three weeks. Have they forgotten you never get much finalization of this sort of thing for at least a year?

The hearing can be viewed on this link:

"Amtrak Derailment" (3:11:07)
http://www.c-span.org/video/?326321-1/h ... derailment
C-SPAN - June 2, 2015

NTSB Preliminary report:

http://ntsb.gov/investigations/Accident ... minary.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I've got a feeling no definitive cause for this wreck will ever be established except that the train speed was exceeding the track geometry by a significant amount and a derailment occurred.

my feeling , lack of experience made him loose his location when his concentration was lost by rocks.

In short Mr. Railnut, a rerun of the 1955 Jenkins Curve incident.

You of course have been around it enough times in your career and without incident and likely in foggy conditions as well. Of course a little different in that the engine crew on locomotive #0363 had nothing other than ABS. There were no radios, no cab signals, and only lineside telephones.

While the Board cannot peer into Mr. Bostian's mind, you likely are correct. I concur with your position.

What will happen with the locomotive?

If and when NTSB releases the cars and 601 back to Amtrak,Amtrak's legal dept will control them untill
all court procedings are over with,as the cars and 601 are considered evidence in any court cases,
and lawsuits.

Mr. Backshop, to carry your immediate thought one step further, will Amtrak be able to make a determination whether 601 can be rebuilt while it is in custody of the NTSB and Legal Department?

If determined the most expedient is to "strip it and scrap it", I would hope such decision could be made before Siemens closes the production line so it could be replaced. Judging from the reports around here that the AEM-7's are dropping like flies of late (no doubt, the only maintenance the survivors are getting is what the FRA says they must), a replacement unit will be needed.

The same thought applies to 626 as well, although from the photos in public circulation of that incident, there appears little question that unit can be repaired and returned to service.

A final thought, now that ACS-64 650 is about to be delivered, Amtrak had best strike "hippo" 650 et seq from the roster; better yet, tell "the Bombers" to get their property away from some "hungry Bears".

No need to worry about Siemens closing the production line any time soon, now that 13 (or 18 if the option is taken) ACS-64's are now on order for SEPTA, delivery to begin in 2018.

Regarding the HHP's, that numbering conflict has already been resolved. They are now 680-694 on the Amtrak roster.

I find it quite intriguing that the politicos are suddenly all impatient to know why the drug test results are not back yet. Why it can't be determined if the engineer had been using his cell phone or not while operating the train. And why they have given the NTSB a 15-day ultimatum to have all the answers to everything. Especially in light of the fact that it takes time for these things, even if in previous cases, the results of those two particular items is usually public knowledge fairly quickly.

At the same time, it is interesting to note that lawmakers were not so vocal over Chase, MD, beyond decrying the fact that the Conrail crew had been under the influence.... but no demands for instant answers beyond the preliminary information that was given.

I wonder if Mr. Boardman's tune would have been the same if Amtrak was not already so far along and close to completing ACSES installation on the NEC. It's only thanks to several lucky breaks that Amtrak, SEPTA, and Metrolink (on trackage they own outright) are more on less on track to make the end of year deadline....

I heard that locomotive 601 was towed away on its own wheels from the ConRail yard where it had come to rest.

Silverliner II wrote:
At the same time, it is interesting to note that lawmakers were not so vocal over Chase, MD, beyond decrying the fact that the Conrail crew had been under the influence.... but no demands for instant answers beyond the preliminary information that was given.

That wasn't the era of instant answers. Nor the era of congresspersons being craven to take advantage of every opportunity to grandstand on an issue or incident.

dt_rt40 wrote:

Silverliner II wrote:
At the same time, it is interesting to note that lawmakers were not so vocal over Chase, MD, beyond decrying the fact that the Conrail crew had been under the influence.... but no demands for instant answers beyond the preliminary information that was given.

That wasn't the era of instant answers. Nor the era of congresspersons being craven to take advantage of every opportunity to grandstand on an issue or incident.

The era of 'sound bites' was in it's infancy and there wasn't a 24 hour news cycle with multiple networks in need of programming to fill the 'news' hours.

And people actually believe, thanks to CSI, that all investigations can be wrapped up in under an hour.

I watched the congressional hearings in part, seen the information that has been released and realize accidents happen and there is no perfection and we have safeguards which will make Amtrak safer overall for others.

But something in that testimony troubled me and stuck out like a sore thumb. We still don't know the cause and the options of what caused the crash are narrow. The infrastructure was fine, train checks out fine and the train had multiple safeguards built in.

They made a comment about the engineers phone records and said something that was clearly not true. They made an allegation his phone records came from a California based provider and due to time zone issues they were having a hard time matching up the records. An intellius search shows the engineer did have a residence in San Francisco, CA at some point in time even though he was based in NY. But time stamps are not confusing at all on calls no matter what the cellular carrier. In Philadelphia, the towers he would have communicated with are all known entites as was his communications unless there was a man in the middle attack frok a rogue cellphone tower or device but even that could be investigated and figured out as well as any hacking of the train systems if they were susceptible to any potential vulnerabilities. We know automotive telematics have vulnerabilities in the system.

The California phone record comment seemed deceptive and cryptic. I also note the other Amtrak forum board seems to have either shut down or banned my IP as it won't allow me access.