LIRR Union Negotiations/Newsday Editorial

What happens to trains (and passengers) already in transit at 12:01a?

Another rally this Saturday (6/21) at the Massapequa Train Station.

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Only 31 days until July 19th

Budd, in past strikes, generally, trains enroute continued to their final destinations.

Much depends on whether the Company shuts down operations or continues to run as it may without engineers striking. An employee who is on the property when a strike is called may choose to continue working until the end of his tour. Once he leaves, most will not re-enter the property as they will be "crossing a picket line" to do so.

While the striking unions will generally walk off the job after their trains arrive at their terminals, those not striking will remain until the end of their tours unless dismissed by the Carrier. Some represented managers - those with unions - will remain on the property for the duration of the strike. Workers choosing to work can also remain.

The deciding factor in all of this is whether the Railroad chooses to shut down and "lock out" employees.

Normally, no union wants to leave passengers stranded. Their fight is not with the customer. So they will generally bring the train to its terminal unless ordered otherwise.

The Railway Labor Act permits the hiring of temporary replacement employees, and that is another story. I doubt anything like that will happen though the Company is adamant that it will run a limited schedule with supervisors and engineers. I'll believe that too when I see it.

Tool predicts that the State will bow to public opinion and refuse to bargain in good faith. The UTU will either sell out by accepting less than it has demanded, or a short strike will ensue. In the event of a strike, Congress will probably intervene and impose the Emergency Board's recommendation. But Tool's no predictor.

If a strike is called would that impact freight traffic on the LIRR right of way. If so such a move can be illegal as it unlawfully harms businesses and the individuals that rely on these businesses to get their goods in a timely fashion. I believe the railroad itself could also be held to pay these businesses for any damages caused if that is the case.

its not illegal read the RLA.

I'll be 100% honest. I am one of those management employees that will be there. Watching the rails rust I suppose.
I still maintain my dues in one of the (possibly) striking craft.

I hope it doesn't come to that honestly.

I wasn't here in '95, so I was curious about trains out on the road when the deadline came and the crafts walked.

Managers all have strike assignments. Since you are probably qualified, you'll have one in an operating craft. Normally, the shutting of operations is quire orderly and accommodating. Nobody wants to see this happen.

If the LIRR is struck, and if the LIRR shuts down, the NY & Atlantic will not operate.

If so such a move can be illegal as it unlawfully harms businesses and the individuals that rely on these businesses to get their goods in a timely fashion. I believe the railroad itself could also be held to pay these businesses for any damages caused if that is the case.

The LIRR contract with the NYAR frees them from any liability in the event of a strike or work stoppage. As things appear to be unfolding, the strike would be legal under the Railway Labor Act as Dutch so correctly said.

LongIslandTool wrote: If the LIRR is struck, and if the LIRR shuts down, the NY & Atlantic will not operate.

That would be the equivalent of a garbage strike, as one of the primary commodities hauled by the NYAR is waste and construction debris. They would need to be allowed operate in that regard alone.

I can speak from experience having been an employee with Metro-North when the UTU pulled the pin in the spring of 1983, a strike that netted them nothing and caused a lot of loss. Both Amtrak and Conrail continued their normal operations over Metro-North tracks. I don't think the dispatchers worked but there were enough supervisors available to take care of that and a couple of key towers that had to be manned due to Amtrak and freight operations. I suspect the New York and Atlantic might well continue to operate during a strike as the LIRR will probably operate a patrol train or two every day using qualified management people. In 1983 Amtrak ran their trains both between New York, Penn Station and New Haven and between New York, GCT, and Poughkeepsie. I don't remember exactly how Amtrak trains were turned in Grand Central Terminal but I think inbound everything came in on the loop and they were simply looped and backed in to tracks 18 or 19 which were their regular tracks in GCT at that time. Metro-North probably provided a Road Foreman and another supervisor to make this move. At that time some of the trains were still using the turbo equipment which could go in solid and not have to go around the loop, they simply changed ends on the platform. I don't think any of the trains went in to the yard for servicing. During that strike I rode Amtrak to both Boston and Toronto out of New York and both trips were without any problems while using Metro-North facilities. How did I get in to Grand Central Terminal without crossing a picket line? It was quite simple, I just took the subway in from home. The UTU in 1983 made it very clear that they did not want to interfere with either Amtrak or Conrail that their job action was strictly with Metro-North. I seem to remember that when the LIRR went out on strike in earlier times that Harold remained in operation to accommodate New Haven trains en route from Boston to Penn Station and beyond. One place where the New Haven was affected in a big way was the lack of the ability to use the facility at Bay Ridge. This line was owned by the LIRR as was the yard at Bay Ridge and Fremont Tower was also manned by the LIRR. The PRR cars enroute to and from NHRR points were generally either routed through Oak Point or through Maybrook where we could interchange with the Lehigh and Hudson River for movement to and from the PRR at Phillipsburh, NJ. It gave us extra work at Oak Point pulling and loading the floats for the PRR and our marine department had a lot of extra work as well.
Noel Weaver

num1hendrickfan wrote:

LongIslandTool wrote: If the LIRR is struck, and if the LIRR shuts down, the NY & Atlantic will not operate.

That would be the equivalent of a garbage strike, as one of the primary commodities hauled by the NYAR is waste and construction debris. They would need to be allowed operate in that regard alone.

If they can operate in a manner like Noel described they will. If not, they wont.
Regardless of what they haul, a strike at this point is legal. The RLA wasn't written with hauling people in mind, it was to keep commodities moving, in this case trash.

If a strike severely affects interstate commerce Congress will step in and end it.

I am not an expert on NY&A's lease agreement, but if there is a strike, what prevents the NY&A from operating from Fresh Pond west and down to Bay Ridge?

Isn't the Lower Montauk under their control? Then NYC's trash would still be handled from Bushwick and at least the westbound carloads could run.
I could see service east being affected. Coastal Distribution wouldn't get its daily C & D gons, service to Brookhaven Terminal, aggregate to Posillico, etc.

Anyway, I am not looking forward to a strike. I commute everyday into Manhattan using the LIRR and have to start planning a contingency plan. Oh boy!

NYA would still be able to operate on their own tracks that they control (i.e. Bushwick, Bay Ridge, Lower Montauk). The question and what will be interesting is what will happen on LIRR-dispatched track. As Noel mentioned above, when Metro North struck back in the 1980's, Amtrak and Conrail both operated, and dispatching was handled by management. As also mentioned, there will most likely be some trains operating during the strike to keep the system operable and for legal reasons, but most likely will be non-revenue trains. Allowing NYA trains to operate over LIRR could kill two birds with one stone, allowing the freight to operate and using their trains instead of their own to keep the system operable.

Also interesting is the union structure - NYA employees are in the BLE, which are not involved in the strike negotiations. Much will depend on how MTA/LIRR handles it, and whether they lock the BLE out. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out...

If the LIRR locks out the BRE cant the NY&A engineers start the day at fresh pond which is NY&A territory? There shouldn't be any picket lines there as its not LIRR territory.

Aside from nyar people, If you are willing to work during a strike,What does a picket line matter? I don't foresee trainmen with baseball bats threatining.Nothing is a secret on the railroad and everyone will know who worked whether you snuck into grand central or crossed a picket line in Jamaica

Decent rally at the Massapequa train station today. Lot of blue shirts in the parking lot when I was taking my daughters to Sports Authority off Sunrise Hwy.