Acela Speeds

Jishnu wrote:

ApproachMedium wrote:

Jishnu wrote:If only the rear pan was up where is the front power head going tog et its power from? Acelas do not have a train length high voltage bus like the TGVs (which enables TGVs to operate with a single pan up) because FRA does not allow such.

Without the front pan up the lead power car wont have propulsion but it will have all aux devices like battery chargers compressor blowers etc. Those can be provided via the 480V HEP trainline. Both power cars have identical setups to provide the HEP in case one craps out.

Would the train not be grossly underpowered with just a single unit operating as power car?

Nope not really. 6,000HP is more than enough to move 6 coach cars up to track speed. It just doesn't have the same acceleration from a stop. Think about an ALP46, 7,100HP with a 6 car train is a rocketship. The things really move. I dont know the weight of the Acela coaches but I cant imagine its that far off. I have heard on the radio engineers upset that the other power car died and its not as fast but then they are asked if they can hit track speed or not by the dispatcher and the answer is almost always yes unless there is issues with the remaining power car left online.

The EGE wrote:It takes about 4 seconds for the 663-foot trainset to pass - that's about 150 feet per second or 100mph. Fast, but definitely not 165.

You're forgetting the 7th trailer car. Makes the set 733 ft instead of the number you quoted. So what is 733 ft in 3 to 3.5 seconds put that last "170 MPH" run in?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4gpZiUyy-U - 1:46.5 to 1:49.5

733ft / 3 seconds = 244 ft/s = 160mph

733ft / 3.5 seconds = 209 ft/s = 140mph

A couple of Amtrak officials were with me and radioed in for a cab speed readout after he passed by and it was indeed 165 on the second to last trip.

ApproachMedium wrote: Nope not really. 6,000HP is more than enough to move 6 coach cars up to track speed. It just doesn't have the same acceleration from a stop. Think about an ALP46, 7,100HP with a 6 car train is a rocketship. The things really move. I dont know the weight of the Acela coaches but I cant imagine its that far off. I have heard on the radio engineers upset that the other power car died and its not as fast but then they are asked if they can hit track speed or not by the dispatcher and the answer is almost always yes unless there is issues with the remaining power car left online.

But actually it would be a 7 trailer car and one dead weight power head being propelled by 6000hp. What is the power required to hold an Acela at 165mph? what distance would need to be covered to accelerate to 165mph? I don't know and would genuinely like to know.

ApproachMedium wrote:I dont know the weight of the Acela coaches but I cant imagine its that far off.

~65 tons, 102 tons for the power car.

On July 23, 1966 New York Central's M-497, a jet-powered RDC-3, hit 183.85 MPH on a test run between Butler, IN and Stryker, OH. The Acela's have a way to go before they will catch the "Black Beetle."

Andy

twropr wrote:On July 23, 1966 New York Central's M-497, a jet-powered RDC-3, hit 183.85 MPH on a test run between Butler, IN and Stryker, OH. The Acela's have a way to go before they will catch the "Black Beetle."

Andy

But the "balck beetle" was not in daily service, it was a one-time thing. I think having regular service, every day, hitting 150 is quite the accomplishment that is often overlooked.

Does anyone have information on the Acela re-testing in NJ that ThirdRail7 mentioned?

Jishnu wrote:

ApproachMedium wrote: Nope not really. 6,000HP is more than enough to move 6 coach cars up to track speed. It just doesn't have the same acceleration from a stop. Think about an ALP46, 7,100HP with a 6 car train is a rocketship. The things really move. I dont know the weight of the Acela coaches but I cant imagine its that far off. I have heard on the radio engineers upset that the other power car died and its not as fast but then they are asked if they can hit track speed or not by the dispatcher and the answer is almost always yes unless there is issues with the remaining power car left online.

But actually it would be a 7 trailer car and one dead weight power head being propelled by 6000hp. What is the power required to hold an Acela at 165mph? what distance would need to be covered to accelerate to 165mph? I don't know and would genuinely like to know.

For todays 125-135-150mph runs, it works.

On July 23, 1966 New York Central's M-497, a jet-powered RDC-3, hit 183.85 MPH on a test run between Butler, IN and Stryker, OH. The Acela's have a way to go before they will catch the "Black Beetle."

to put things in perspective the above was done on bolted sectional track and the vehicle used was a Budd RDC3 which had a max design speed like half of that test

and ...

150 MPH on a regular basis (abeit briefly on certain sections of the NEC - most of the time like half that speed and sometimes 0 MPH when derailed) with passengers is quite a high speed for the US but alas 70 MPH or so slower than some I.C.E. trains,mfg. by Siemens, in Europe do on a regular basis - the Acela trainsets are like 1st or 2nd gen? HS trains -the Acelas have power units on either end of the trainset - the cars in between are non-powered - the NEW gen of HS trainsets are E.M.U.s the entire trainset is powered

and further,I think the original Japenese 'bulet' trains had a max speed of 150 MPH - this was in the late 1960's around the same time as the above NYCRR M497 jet train experiment - I found a great video by NYCRR of this and posted it on the self propeled rail car thread

I understand the testing was done in the Perryville area last night. Any idea where they will be tonight?

[quote="bigK"
and further,I think the original Japenese 'bulet' trains had a max speed of 150 MPH -[/quote]
Commercial speed was 125mph. That is what got NECIP going and there was much celebration when the Metroliners managed to get upto 160 or thereabouts on test runs. The difference is that the Japanese went on making steady progress and regularly operate at 186mph and higher now, whereas we dropped the ball.

Anyone have a clue as the acceleration specs of an Acela Trainsset?

If it starts from a dead stop in Trenton, NJ, going North, how long/how far does it
have to go at full acceleration (lets say empty trainset for this test), before
it reaches the holy grail 165 mph?

I live close to the Hamilton station, (about 10-12 miles north of Trenton), and wonder how fast it would
have been travelling if I tried to sneak a midnight view.

thanx...

and another question-
anyone know the max speed allowed in the Hudson River Tunnels?

ha, assume I mean leaving the city; emerging full speed from the tunnel into
Penn Station track yard/passenger docks could be problematic...