Adirondack Scenic Railroad (ADIX) Discussion - 2012

OK Cool! Thanks for the reply

Alek S

As they say, "the truth will out."

There are those who feel that the backers of the effort to turn the Adirondack Division into a "rail trail" may have ulterior motives...

An editorial appears in the Albany Times Union this morning (Tuesday, September 18th) and here is a link. Obviously I do not agree with them BUT the Adirondack Scenic Railroad could help their cause by getting a little bit more of this line up to shape to run passenger trains over. How about from Carter Station north to Beaver River, maybe this would help. This line has potential that would be similiar to the Saratoga and North Creek IF they would just extend it a bit north. I am afraid that the state will let this slip away and once it does it will be gone for good, I hope I am wrong.

http://blog.timesunion.com/opinion/the- ... dnt/22088/

Noel Weaver

In my opinion, it's kind of a half-assed editorial. They estimated they could make the trail for only figure 5.3 million
with no taxpayer cost by salvaging the rails/ties. That's fine, but what about the cost of upkeeping this trail? The
snowmobiles will tear up the trail in the winter, so how much will it cost to fix the trail every spring? Will these dollars
come out of our pocket? Seems like a rather incomplete article!

Not the best example of journalism in my humble opinion!

Charlie

The editorial is loaded with points I thought were addressed earlier. Why are they counting on the money from salvage? Seems to me it would go to the state, since the state owns the property in the first place. Also, as usual, I don't buy the usage figures. There are too many large gaps with no services for bikers and hikers. I know there are some hard core trail users that would go the long distances in between towns, but not in the numbers quoted. The snowmobiles are another matter. They do like the long distances, but I don't think the new trail would really attract many more riders to the region than are already there in the first place. There's also the issue of the sections that may revert to wilderness, with no usage at all.

Like every other time an editorial like this comes out, all we can do is point out the nonsense in it, and continue to prod the ADIX people to put their own point of view out there as well. Finally opening a new section of the line would help greatly, too.

Scott K.

charlie6017 wrote:In my opinion, it's kind of a half-assed editorial.

That's the best part of writing an opinion piece. You don't need any research or facts to back it up. It's not news, so you're not held to any "journalistic" standard.

The only way Adirondack Scenic can win this fight is if they engage some professionals to get their point of view out there. A coordinated public relations effort would quash all this nonsense. Unfortunately, hiring professionals costs money, too...

-otto-

Maybe they should just keep the scenic tours they do now in Old Forge and Lake Placid, and use the rest for a trail? That seems like the best option.

railfan324 wrote:Maybe they should just keep the scenic tours they do now in Old Forge and Lake Placid, and use the rest for a trail? That seems like the best option.

No, that is a stupid idea. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

-otto-

What are the longest tourism railroads in the US? Are any longer then a fully restored Adirondack Scenic Railroad will be? I know that the Grand Canyon Railway is a bit over 60 miles long, and is privately owned, is profitable, and has a destination that attracts people from all over the world. What is the attraction in Lake Placid that will get people to travel nearly twice that distance that wasn't there when the state shut down their version of the railroad?

The Grand Canyon has a destination but in the case of the Adirondack Scenic the trip can and should be the destination in itself. The scenery along this line is above the scenery on any other railroad line in the northeast. Much of the territory can't be reached by any other means of transportation short of hiking or ATV's which ruin the landscape. A trail will benefit the healthy and mostly young who are fit to use it but for seniors, handicapped and other folks who want to enjoy a ride in the country and beautiful country at that, the train is the ticket, not a trail. There is no reason that even with diesel power this line could not equal the other longer operations. Lake Placid itself is a world class destination with the olympic facities still there and in use, a beautiful lake, country resorts, skiing and summer activities as well. A railroad will bring in much more in tourist dollars than a trail will. The trail would be too long to easily handle anyway and there are other trails in the Adirondacks as well.
Noel Weaver

joshuahouse wrote:What are the longest tourism railroads in the US? Are any longer then a fully restored Adirondack Scenic Railroad will be? I know that the Grand Canyon Railway is a bit over 60 miles long, and is privately owned, is profitable, and has a destination that attracts people from all over the world. What is the attraction in Lake Placid that will get people to travel nearly twice that distance that wasn't there when the state shut down their version of the railroad?

I'm at a loss. when did the state shut down any railroad?

My understanding was that this line was operated by the state to serve the 1980 Winter Olympics at Lake Placid.

Nope. State owned the tracks and leased them to a private company that fixed them up and operated the trains. Many factors led to the shut down of the Adirondack Railway Corperation in 1980, but none because the State of New York said so.

This railroad is a true gem and needs to be restored to see it's true potential, but then again, I've said this before (happy to be the broken record).

Noel Weaver wrote:The scenery along this line is above the scenery on any other railroad line in the northeast.

If someone had ridden a speeder down that line, they would agree with you.

A response to the posts since the 9/17 Times Union editorial. I believe I submitted a similar post yesterday. If I am no longer able to post, then I have achieved in just a few months what Otto Vondrak has been trying to achieve since 1996.

Upkeep: The Northern Rail Trail going east from Lebanon, New Hampshire is lengthy, sees much snowmobile use during the winter, and requires only minimal maintenance each spring.

Salvage: The UMP clearly states that the salvage value of the rails should be used for trail construction.

Usage: Probably not 240,000 on this challenging route, but 40,000 is very realistic and way more than the 7,000 riders as stated in the Stone Consulting study commissioned by the railroad.

Snowmobiles: Due to the lack of snow, virtually no snowmobiles went to Tupper Lake last winter. With the rails removed, there would have been about a two month season for snowmobiling on that section of the Corridor.

Status without rails: The UMP clearly states that it will remain a travel corridor with or without the rails. Given how hard DOT has fought to retain the rails, I think it is fair to say they would fight even harder to retain the travel corridor. Besides, even the Adirondack Council has stated that they will accept the travel corridor status.

Destination: Joshuahouse is right that Lake Placid is a good destination. Unfortunately, the distance is more than twice the distance of the Grand Canyon run, and unlike the Grand Canyon, one needs a vehicle once in Lake Placid to get to its many attractions. The daily Trailways delivers zero to four riders to Lake Placid each run according to a friend who rides that bus regularly. Zero to four is hardly a trainload.