Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

Moderators: Tadman, ACeInTheHole, Kaback9, nick11a

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby CNJ Fan 4evr » Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:27 am

Friday Dec.11,2015 Express-Times had an article about possibility of an Amtrak inspection train running between Allentown and NY and Allentown and Phila.They say it MIGHT happen as early as next year. I won't hold my breath. They ran over the Cutoff to Scranton in 1979 and we see where that has gone in 36 years.
CNJ Fan 4evr
 
Posts: 352
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:49 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby philipmartin » Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:52 am

CNJ Fan 4evr wrote: and we see where that has gone in 36 years.
Andover? Or is there a "wetlands" government problem there.
Below: current occupants of the cut-off.
Attachments
Lackawanna_Cut-Off_-_storage_of_rolling_stock_Apr_3_2013_at_Port_Morris.jpg
User avatar
philipmartin
 
Posts: 3652
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:42 pm
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby CNJ Fan 4evr » Wed Dec 16, 2015 1:35 pm

That is a picture of New Jersey taxpayer money ......well spent. :( Is it any wonder when NJT cries poverty we say "Shut Up !!!"
CNJ Fan 4evr
 
Posts: 352
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:49 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby jp1822 » Fri Dec 25, 2015 1:15 am

NJT has not disposed of the ALP44's yet? What are they waiting for? They have to be good for some scrap value. I can't think of any other electrified railroad that would want them!
jp1822
 
Posts: 3798
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:03 pm
Location: New York, NY

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby philipmartin » Fri Dec 25, 2015 4:26 pm

When they do get it built, who's going to be able to afford to ride it? Today a round trip fare from my station, Middletown, NJ, to New York is $30.50, and some people are surprised by it. The round trips from Trenton or Annandale / High Bridge are two or three dollars more. Trans Bridge bus charges $47.50 for a round trip, Pburg- New York today, and I don't see mention of a monthly ticket on their website.
Last edited by philipmartin on Sat Dec 26, 2015 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
philipmartin
 
Posts: 3652
Joined: Sun Jul 13, 2008 3:42 pm
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby time » Sat Dec 26, 2015 9:28 am

Port Jervis to Hoboken is almost $40 round trip, and people do that. It's certainly an expensive trip, but when you start thinking about gas, car maintenance and depreciation, city parking cost, time spent driving, etc., it's worth it to some people.
time
 
Posts: 163
Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:28 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby ThirdRail7 » Sat Dec 26, 2015 10:53 am

CNJ Fan 4evr wrote:That is a picture of New Jersey taxpayer money ......well spent. :( Is it any wonder when NJT cries poverty we say "Shut Up !!!"


The ALP-44s as delivered were not designed to haul/push the fleet of double deckers. Remember, it was the whiny passengers that said "NO THIRD ROW SEATING," so now that you have cars without them, additional horsepower was needed. Since the cost of modifying the ALP-44s approached the cost of a new, higher horsepower engine, the decision was obvious. Ante up! You get what you order!!!!

jp1822 wrote:NJT has not disposed of the ALP44's yet? What are they waiting for? They have to be good for some scrap value. I can't think of any other electrified railroad that would want them!


They are waiting for the terms and conditions they were bought under to expire. They were under a 25 year provision. Amtrak will have the same problems with the HHP-8s. Unless there is an early buyout, they will sit around until the provisions expire, sometime in the 2020s.

philipmartin wrote:When they do get it built, who's going to be able to afford to ride it? Today a round trip fare from my station, Middletown, NJ, to New York is $30.50, and some people are surprised by it. The round trips from Trenton and Annandale / High Bridge are two or three dollars more. Trans Bridge bus charges $47.50 for a round trip, Pburg- New York today, and I don't see mention of a monthly ticket on their website.


This is off topic, but I always think the same thing when people reference Amtrak's high speed plan. Sure, the goal is for 220mph operation, but who will be able to afford the fare?
I want my road foreman!
ThirdRail7
 
Posts: 4040
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:07 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby SemperFidelis » Sat Dec 26, 2015 1:25 pm

Not at all to belittle your point, because it is taken, but I think calling passengers (the customers of commuter rail) "whiney" is an odd choice. The customers of a service had a complaint and they voiced it. The service provider responded to those concerns. If this were a restaurant with seating issues we wouldn't call the patrons whiney and we would think positively of a management team that changed seating arrangements to better meet the desires of thier customers.

Is it whining to tell those that provide you with your transportation that you'd rather not be shoehorned between two strangers many of whom, this being America, might be somewhat larger than average and some of whom, people being people, will not have the best hygenic standards? I hated the middle seat and I'm glad it's gone.

Again, no offense meant to your point of view, I just don't think customers should be called whiners when they do what they're askd to do and provide thier input.

And yeah, the fares are getting out of control. My father and I took my sons on an excursion to Hoboken from Port Jervis last year and got weekend fares, disabled fares, etc. and it cost under $50. This year, the same trip is going to cost a little over $100. Ridiculous.
SemperFidelis
 
Posts: 1316
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 3:49 pm
Location: Stupid Voterland

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby ThirdRail7 » Sat Dec 26, 2015 3:18 pm

SemperFidelis wrote:Not at all to belittle your point, because it is taken, but I think calling passengers (the customers of commuter rail) "whiney" is an odd choice. The customers of a service had a complaint and they voiced it. The service provider responded to those concerns. If this were a restaurant with seating issues we wouldn't call the patrons whiney and we would think positively of a management team that changed seating arrangements to better meet the desires of thier customers.

Is it whining to tell those that provide you with your transportation that you'd rather not be shoehorned between two strangers many of whom, this being America, might be somewhat larger than average and some of whom, people being people, will not have the best hygenic standards? I hated the middle seat and I'm glad it's gone.

Again, no offense meant to your point of view, I just don't think customers should be called whiners when they do what they're askd to do and provide thier input.

And yeah, the fares are getting out of control. My father and I took my sons on an excursion to Hoboken from Port Jervis last year and got weekend fares, disabled fares, etc. and it cost under $50. This year, the same trip is going to cost a little over $100. Ridiculous.



Your point is taken as well, sir. Passengers of the served voiced their preference. It was answered....however, the implications are partially responsible for higher fares...to which there are additional complaints...that is why I used the term whiney.

You can't have it both ways. The ALPS-44 could have gone on for quite some time if NJT ordered single level equipment. The capital funds used to purchase the ALP-46s/ALP-46a could have been spent on other things or preserved. However, they listened to their passengers and ordered these heavy, HEP sucking cars....so someone doesn't have to occupy the middle seat. You received what you asked for. Why complain about benched, outmoded equipment?

It is frustrating to see a constant wave of complaints when you actually gave people what they asked for.
I want my road foreman!
ThirdRail7
 
Posts: 4040
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:07 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby CNJ Fan 4evr » Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:18 am

How many more passengers do the bi-levels hold ? When I view them from the outside it looks like the ends of the cars are "wasted space". Mind you that is observing them from outside only . I have never been in one.
CNJ Fan 4evr
 
Posts: 352
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2012 2:49 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby Nicholas Chen » Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:40 am

I'm assuming you mean multilevels not bilevels (NJT and AMT run multilevels, GO and Caltrain, etc. run bilevels)

They are supposed to hold:
  • 127 for the cab cars
  • 142 for the trailer cars
  • 132 for the trailer cars with restrooms
For comparison, Comet Vs are supposed to hold 109-117 people.
I do believe when the Multilevels were out NJT said they were supposed to hold 20% more people.
The ends if the car aren't exactly wasted space they are flip down seats for bikes and wheelcahirs and also have the restrooms on cars with them.

And yes, fares have gotten quite expensive, but a bus ride on Martz Trailways is hovering around $40 for a one way trip to New York from the Mt Pocono area. I don't want to know how expensive the train will be.
User avatar
Nicholas Chen
 
Posts: 127
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:16 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby mohawkrailfan » Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:08 pm

Nicholas Chen wrote:The ends if the car aren't exactly wasted space they are flip down seats for bikes and wheelcahirs and also have the restrooms on cars with them.


I'd also add that those sections have the only racks on the MLVs where you can store an average suitcase.
Make a little noise at the flag location.
User avatar
mohawkrailfan
 
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:13 am

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby ccutler » Mon Dec 28, 2015 2:23 pm

Another benefit of the multilevels' 20% increased capacity over comet cars is that NJ transit has more capacity per foot of length at its platforms at NYP and Newark. If seats were the only consideration, NJ Transit could have removed the 5-seat row chairs and replaced them with 4-seat row chairs.
Of course, maybe NJ Transit hired an engineering firm for a hefty fee who determined that the cost of replacing the chairs was higher than buying new passenger cars. :P
ccutler
 
Posts: 867
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:17 pm

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby Ken W2KB » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:29 pm

Nicholas Chen wrote:I'm assuming you mean multilevels not bilevels (NJT and AMT run multilevels, GO and Caltrain, etc. run bilevels)

They are supposed to hold:
  • 127 for the cab cars
  • 142 for the trailer cars
  • 132 for the trailer cars with restrooms
For comparison, Comet Vs are supposed to hold 109-117 people.
I do believe when the Multilevels were out NJT said they were supposed to hold 20% more people.
The ends if the car aren't exactly wasted space they are flip down seats for bikes and wheelcahirs and also have the restrooms on cars with them.

And yes, fares have gotten quite expensive, but a bus ride on Martz Trailways is hovering around $40 for a one way trip to New York from the Mt Pocono area. I don't want to know how expensive the train will be.


Also, the overhead luggage racks in the end seating area will fit large bags. The lower and upper seating areas accommodate nothing or briefcase size.
~Ken :: Fairmont ex-UP/MP C436 MT-14M1 ::
Black River Railroad Historical Trust :: [/url]
User avatar
Ken W2KB
 
Posts: 5735
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 9:27 pm
Location: Lebanon Township, Hunterdon County, New Jersey & Tiverton, RI USA

Re: Phillipsburg Rail Service—Four Years, $90 Million

Postby NIMBYkiller » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:00 am

My apologies if this isn't the right thread for this (in which case some direction would be appreciated) or if it's already been covered, but if this extension were actually to go all the way to Allentown, what would be the running time to NYP? Let's assume after P'burg it went express to Newark just to speed things up. How would it compare to an extension from Hackettstown instead?
NIMBYkiller
 
Posts: 1444
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:24 pm
Location: Port Washington

PreviousNext

Return to New Jersey Transit NJT Rail and Light Rail LRT

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Feedfetcher and 6 guests